Sorry for the wall of text, but I would like to have a serious discussion about this. I understand that Bernie is not a seize the means of production revolutionary. As many of us would clearly like to have. However, in this moment he has accelerated class consciousness and altered the framing of political discourse and debate in America, there is no question of that. It is important to recognize the transformation that even pseudo-socialist ideas are now becoming palatable to the masses (Merriam Websters most searched word in 2015 was socialism). These transformations of framing are important if you recognize Mao's mass line theory or techniques of sociological/political/economic propaganda as important tenets of developing social consciousness. The point is this, we should be very careful not to underestimate language and framing. There is a propaganda war that we are badly losing comrades. There is no mass movement without the masses. If the goal of r/socialism is to foster authoritarian style state communism then I can understand the dismissal of the Bernie Sanders movement (I believe the authoritarian style state communism faction to be the minority however) nor do I believe that you are all accelerationists either. Senator Sanders Social Democratic policies, are bland to many of us who long for something more, however we should not be quick to dismiss a movement that is bland when socialist discourse on the national stage has been starved for decades. By Sanders simply putting the word "socialist" in the national rhetoric at a moment when it's possible that most Americans are longing for answers to crony capitalism we should be discussing ways to expand the debate, further the consciousness and build off of this movement. I have seen for myself an awakening in the youth where their cynicism/nihilism hasn't set in yet, and neither have they settled for reform or become entrenched in regressive neo-liberalism. In fact they appear to be a generation of info/technocrats whose belief systems are driven by data, facts, reason, logic, and history in a way that allows revolution to be a very real and "trending" opportunity. We would be remiss to shun this awakening in a subreddit devoted to socialism, of all places. It will be a success even if the only thing that Bernie accomplishes is the reawakening and demystifying of one simple word, socialism, so that this simple word that encompasses a very important ideology is no longer a pejorative in American culture. This should be heralded, and applauded as a success because he will have accomplished leaps and bounds more than my socialist book-club's reading of "Das Kapital" on Sundays. He is pulling a broad spectrum of people into the discussion. Do we all understand the importance of this? It still appears that r/socialism has the opportunity to become a solutions focused group which understands the importance of embracing and absorbing the Bernie Sanders movement or run the risk of becoming an echo chamber of arm chair revolutionaries. If we had 4 or 8 years of a "self described democratic socialist" even though we know it to be euro style social democracy. It will still be night and day different than Hillary or the Republicans. If you don't believe that is true I would ask you to simply look at the powers of the executive branch in regards to enforcement of existing powers. Elizabeth Warren just published a scathing op-ed of the current administration. If you think Bernie would be powerless due to congress, you are again proving to me you a lack of knowledge of the current political climate. If Bernie is elected, that means turnout would have been huge and flip the senate, oh and the house has ALL seats up for grabs. This silly talk that the house is "firmly" held by the republicans is hogwash. The tea party'rs will be sent packing as quickly as their obstructionists zealotry rose, quickly. If you think not participating gives you a voice, then don't respond to this post. (Good job, you proved my point) Bernie is not a messiah, but he is a wake up call for many, many people, the revolution isn't coming unless you get off your ass and engage with his supporters. If you can't see the positives that Bernie and this movement bring to the table then you must have been asleep for the last 40 years in American politics. I can back up my above thesis without name calling, however the dismissive and elitist posts on this so called forward thinking socialist subreddit pissed me off recently. Bernie is not a savior, but he's a fucking conversation starter, honey catches more bees than hot sauce my friends. Honey = Bernie neutral/positive rhetoric (not asking you to compromise your values, however empathy is needed because everyone is not awake/conscious) Bees = comrades in training Hot sauce = dismissive elitist rhetoric Happy to discuss, might not be able to respond till later.