Why is your religion right, and others wrong? Are you lucky?

I did not say selfish or selfless for that matter. I said self centered. But that's beside the point.

They are synonymous.

I'm sure that you understand that even words that are synonyms can still have different connotations and different shades of meaning.

I was trying to use a phrase that carried less of the negative judgmental connotations that the word "selfish" carries. A person can be self centered and exhibit behavior that supports her enlightened self interest and at the same time not be regarded as selfish by her peers.

But, as I wrote, this is all beside the point. I really don't want to get bogged down in an argument over words.

This is what the Abrahamic religions mean when they warn against idolizing.

What?

My understanding, and I could be wrong on any of these points, is that in Jewish tradition the commandment that "You will have no other gods before me" is interpreted as an admonition against idolatry. IOW you should be worshipping God; not an idol or any representation of God. This is because no representation of God in the form of a work of art of any kind can come close to representing the tiniest fraction of the infinite nature of an infinite God. To do so is a grave sin, that of presumptuousness. (Remember the story about how Moses came down from the mountain with the commandments to find his nomadic nation worshipping a golden calf?) And, as Jews are wont to do, the orthodox interpretation of this is to go completely overboard and to ban all representational art altogether. This is why, when you go into an Orthodox Jewish cemetery, you will find on the headstones no trace of paintings or sculptures of the dead people or angels or of the face of God the way you find them in Christian cemeteries. You will only find abstract geometrical sculptures of stars of David and the like. Did you ever wonder why Medieval and Renaissance art that is full of people places and things is almost exclusively European Christian? Or why Islamic art is known for the intricate complexity of its geometrical designs and not for their landscapes or portraiture? Yes, even the Islamic resentment of images of Mohammed stems from this. The fact is that these bans simply don't work, or only work for a limited time, usually a few hundred years. Once people start traveling and see how other cultures employ art, they want to try it for themselves. That's simply how artists are.

Idolizing doesn't just mean worshipping works of representational art. It is also possible to idolize books and ideas so that the ritual worship becomes more important than the understanding. Some sects of American Evangelism have been accused of idolizing the bible by insisting that every word, every verse be interpreted literally.

When the ideas, the words, the ritual takes precedence over the understanding, that is also idolizing.

But again this is all rather beside the point.

The point that I was trying, and obviously failing, to make was that when you enter the contest that the OP was setting up between the four children, each of whom is acting as a cheerleader for their own team, and you start cheering for yet a fifth team, you will inevitably resemble the other four teams. You have more in common with them than there are differences. I'm sorry, but that's the way I see it. You did it to yourself by focusing on the details. It makes no difference to me that yours may be a non-theistic religion. It doesn't matter what Buddha or any of his followers said or didn't say. You are now competing for my attention using the same tactics as all of those other religions.

I sympathize for you. It is not a pleasant position to be in. The only way to win the game is to not play.

/r/DebateReligion Thread Parent