All men are created equal

A principle that was revolutionary in its time. Say what you want about the political ideology of our founding fathers. Clearly it has its short comings from todays perspective. But back then it was revolutionary political ideology that acts as the spark for modern political thought.

The US flag is not a battle flag? It was and is carried into battle then and today. Strike two.

The US doesn't have traditional national/battle flags, however the CSA did. Even though the US flag has been used in battle, under absolutely no circumstances is it a battle flag. The international standard is to not flaunt the use of battle flags in areas where there is the remote chance of a flag controversy. Go to Korea or China waving a Japanese flag and it won't be a big deal. However do the same with a Japanese battle flag and it will be a huge fucking deal.

If it was the CSA national flag that was always be waved around, those who say it is controversial will have a major talking point disappear. Personally I believe the fact that it is a battle flag is the most controversial part about the situation. In absolutely no circumstances, in any situation like this for any flag, can then use of a battle flag be excused.

The fact that Japan changed its land battle flag post WWII & the widespread ban of any and all Nazi flags should clue you in on the the fundamental difference between a national and battle flag.

I really dont think that one fact is the linchpin of a great argument though

You mean the fact that it was a failed rebellion against our current government isn't a solid argument? I'd say that's one of the best arguments there is.

Good tends to outweigh the bad? Do you want to measure that good in lives lost due to a particular flag? Ultimately I think the CSA is responsible for less lives lost than the American Flag. So Im not sure your making a good point there.

The point went over your head. Iwo Jima, US moon landings, etc. THAT is what I was talking about. Give a country enough time and it can rebound from its darker periods of history. However the CSA never had that chance. It was ended before its legacy could ever become anything other than bigotry and racism. And of course being a country founded on the concept of preserving slavery for eternity.

I think people of the South are as entitled to feel pride in their heritage as any other American is entitle to feel pride in being an American. The whole "your hands are dirty" argument just smacks of ignorance when you consider all of American history.

The 1st amendment gives people the freedom to associate themselves with vile, disgusting, and ignorant talking points. It is our constitution that allows the CSA flags to be glorified today when they really should have gone down the path of the Nazi flags. It's the one drawback of all the perks we have thanks to the constitution. The current status of the CSA flag is nothing more than 150 years of ignorance about what the flag actually means. It's the closest thing there is to a swastika, and yet a lot of people like yourself are total oblivious to that fact. Instead you resort to terrible talking points to justify the use of it.