Yeah I do agree to a point that we're focusing too much on feminism, that it becomes more about criticizing obvious feminist sexism and misandry, then actual discussion of LEGAL mens' rights issues (while the latter conversations exist here, it unfortunately pales in comparison the amount of 'feminism' references as well as upvotes.). While it's cool to criticize attitudes contributing to stigmatizing and demonizing men or the widespread ignorance of boy's problems, which is rampant in feminist spaces.... Maybe we should just ignore feminism entirely. Be apathetic to it. Take a break. For a while. Cause it seems to be more harmful to our cause than actually directly helping boys just to yell at feminism, and acting as more as a diversion currently.
I mean:
We could go over people quoting Gloria Steinem (could really care less if i spelled her name wrong) or we could start up plans to create male shelters. Or good geographical locations of potential sites. Like wherever most reported domestic violence against men.
We could get mad over cups with male tears and kill all men logo's sold (which yes support gender roles and normalization of violence against men respectively, but are still just cups), or we could try to conduct or organize peer-reviewed studies of the situation/ state of male victims of what have you: suicide/ rape/ domestic violence. Collect surveys. ect.
We could foam at shitty feminists articles with long rants or We could start writing up literature or comics or discussion panels outside of reddit with NO NEED for feminist inspiration or prompting or even reference.
Just get creative. While we could complain about microaggressions, we can do something that will actually directly help boys instead. Criticism has it's place, but not when it's all you do.
The mrm needs to stop being simply or even 'mostly' a "REBUTTAL" to feminism. And create its OWN content more. Be original. And not WAIT for some inevitable asshole feminist to say something stupid in order for yourself to say something relative to the mrm, because that's ALREADY GOTTEN OLD. Honestly this dialogue has been a long time coming. And Inb4: "concern trolling" accusation or whatever the fuck, NOT any real argument worth a penny that's gonna fly.
The thing with HYPERFOCUSING on negativity of the other movement is that it STARTS becoming your defining characteristic and the bigger trait that identifies you, and taking up most of your time and how strangers are exposed to you, and that is a problem with more than just 'reputation' but also priorities and what stuff is ACTUALLY getting accomplished (asides from verbalized angry boners at assholes and sexists).
Which leads me to the question: Are you an antifeminist first or an mra first? And skip the "they can't be mutually exclusive bit". Yes they absolutely can, and if you had a choice what would you choose?
If you say antifeminist first. And you have a deeper desire to articulate anger at feminism than you do to advocate for other men. Then you're NOT going to be a positive force here. You need to STOP getting caught up on feminism. It should NOT be defining you, you should not be SO COMPLETELY obsessed with it - even in anger- that it is taking over your WOULD-BE PASSION for other things- such as advocacy for human rights. It is effectively taxing, draining and leeching our energy, even if you don't care to notice.
And this is coming from someone with quite a few antifeminist views, but still doesn't label antifeminist. Because I don't want something I DISLIKE to define me even remotely or relational to my identity even in an "anti-stance". Nor do I want it to make myself incapable of genuine analysis in favor of generalizations or oversimplifying. (e.g. All feminists are evil or ignorant.) I don't want anger to make me effectively stupid and stop rationalizing because i'm mad or pay attention to other things, in other words.
The "whole hatred consumes you" -and your energy and efforts and FOCUS, thing is more relevant than ever before. EVEN IF that hatred is justified. It's come to a point where it is NOT productive anymore. It is hindering you, it is not advancing. It's all been said, or resaid a thousand different ways. We could put all that energy somewhere else better used. Like use feminism as the reverse role model in this situation:
Feminists are obsessed with men, even if it's in the negative, and are constantly distracted by men as an idea, influencing most of their work and even taking their money: (The finances they wasted on the manspreading shindig anyone?). They are OBSESSED and it shows. That's why feminism is defined by their man-hating. Because it is their distinct paranoia. And that HAS BEEN detrimental to them and their cause.
Mras are also obsessed with feminism, even if it's in the negative, and are yes, distracted by feminism. (Looking at the action flair in comparison to the feminism flair. lol) One would think you shouldn't want to be like feminists in that regard.
Like genuinely what do you want more and foremost: a space to criticize feminism? or a space to get shit done and get a fix to male issues that much faster. Because right now, tbh, it doesn't seem to be working to have 'both those spaces' in the same place. I am NOT seeing results. Just a lot of feminism overshadowing everything else, even when it's not being supported. And I don't know about you, but isn't that fucking frustrating?
Feminism is STILL being prioritized by the mrm as topic. Are you sure you're doing feminism a disservice, or actually the Mrm? Cause I'm not sure it's actually hurting who we think it's hurting anymore. Maybe it's gotten overboard. Like I'm not saying we have to be profeminist- or ignore its activism that has directly hurt men, but we need to stop letting it be the most relevant thing here.
I stand by that the mrm subreddit should be more about the mrm than feminism. One further, it should be more about BOYS than feminism. But I'm not seeing that. And if nobody else here has similar sentiments that they should change, I guess I'm in the wrong group.